on the treatment of women and occupation

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A radical friend has recently been "won to supporting Israel" (as if there were some sort of binary choice). A major factor is the treatment of women in societies around Israel being worse than in the state of Israel itself-- well, let's say the 1967 boundaries since the charge of human rights violations against women in particular is implicitly making Palestinians worthy of occupation. Honor killings in particular were mentioned, and I needed

Two points on that, beyond that the absolute number of women and children killed by the military occupation and economic stranglehold of areas of Palestine are far greater than those killed by honor killings.

First, the lawless conditions engendered by military offensives makes matters worse.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/1120/p01s01-wome.html

I have long felt that the options are extend full citizenship, including laws and police enforcement that in this case would be better with regards to women's and human rights, or get out of the area entirely. Occupation, missiles, and re-invasion are hardly ever good for anyone's rights.

Second, the groups actually fighting for human rights on the ground are fighting honor killings, bad laws and bad enforcement in the territories, and the occupation all together.
http://www.pchrgaza.org/files/PressR/English/2009/49-2009.html

Comments

unsurprisingly given the

unsurprisingly given the incoherence of my post above:

I think I'm the radical friend won to supporting Israel who makes a strawman appearance on your blog. Am I? If so, "strawman" is a good way of describing the way you set up my position. You didn't make any points I didn't concede that night. You really didn't get what I was talking about, apparently.

And I don't even understand what you mean by proposing that there ISN'T some sort of binary choice, ultimately, about whether or not to support Israel. In a very real sense, OTHERS (many others, many others much more powerful than me, but also many less powerful activists) DO frame the issue as EITHER/OR...you either accept Israel, or you call for its destruction. And what I was saying on that night is that I've been won to accepting it. I don't think this is a small point to be making, not these days.

Anyway, I don't think that post did anyone any good, because it didn't capture the topic at hand, let alone advance discussion on it.